Football: Highlight film database
As promised, I’ve posted links to a highlight films of local players below. There are a number of them on YouTube, but I’m sure it is far from complete.
If yours isn’t here but you’d like it added to the list, please shoot me an e-mail at jthomson@lohud.com and I’ll add it as soon as I can.
For those of you who haven’t seen some of these players on film, here’s a good opportunity. It may go a long way in changing your opinions.
Kieran Borcich, OT/DE, Bronxville — http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GJuHFQ_B5to&feature=related
Justin Ciero, QB/DB, Horace Greeley — http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M9k8wOO4KX0&feature=related
Capri Corn, RB, New Rochelle — http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0FWIei3OKgM&feature=related
Connor Eck, QB, Rye — http://www.cpoa.com/video/10020700.wmv
Tyrell Goodman, QB, Stepinac — http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qUJae_Jx0zw&feature=related
Ryan Hackett, CB, Bronxville — http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bnOWUVyfLl0&feature=related
Gustavo Larramendi, RB/LB, Horace Greeley — http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8mfae6ge_mo&feature=related
Michael Longo, LB, Iona Prep — http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DYO-ySAvwZs
Jordan Lucas, RB/DB, New Rochelle — http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LbJ9nRSQhxc
Joseph Magardino, C, Horace Greeley — http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=etvPKbyFUn8&feature=related
Dillon Mitchell, RB/KR, Bronxville — http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0LXRNd33bKU
Aaron Morgenstern, RB/SS, Ketcham — http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mkXJ-xBOuwc
Tom O’Riordan, K/P, North Rockland — http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MwOe1uzwthI
Brian Pickup, HB/LB, Rye — http://blimptv.blip.tv/file/3672579/
Stephen Shoemaker, LG/DL, Bronxville — http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lUipzO6RMsU&feature=related
Donnie Simmons, TE/DL, Stepinac — http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_3RQnGpykwc
Kevin Soares, FB/LB, Croton-Harmon — http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NpYjZsI4g7w&feature=related
Ryan Wagner, QB/HB/WR/LB/CB, Mahopac — http://provisionmedia.org/RyanWagner.html
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Hoops,
Not sure what this means “But I’ve never heard any fan of NYS football not put Vin O’Connor #1 among NYS coaches”. Of course I do not know what circles you keep nor does it matter.
There is always going to be BIAS when it comes to who is the best(case in point?). Whether it is RB, WR, Team, Area, State, ect.. The only thing we have are facts. We have win/losses and and not much else. Even if CHSFL was the best currently, let me know what Paterno and Schiano say about the last 50+++ years. Doubt they will get back to you.
Again my problem is when you say “undoubtedley”, I just do not see the proof. Have the last word.
Just a fact,
You can disagree with “undoubtedly”, but you can’t say you don’t see the proof. Winning 13 championships in UNDOUBTEDLY the best league in the state (CHSFL) is incredibly impressive. Coaching scores of major college players, several college All Americans, over 10 future NFL players speaks for itself.
Regarding the statement you say you didn’t understand. I’d implore you to ask anyone you consider a longtime expert in NYS football – Joe Paterno (he’s recruited NYS longer than many have been alive), Mike Quick, TOny DeMatteo, any HS football writer at the NY Post, Daily News or Newsday and ask them who they think is the greatest or most accomplished HS football coach in NYS history. I think you’d only get one name from all of those people.
Paterno’s comments about the CHSFL being the most competitive league in America go back to the 70’s. To clarify, that statement is not to say the best teams in the CHSFL are the best in the country, but top to bottom, the most overall competitive – no cupcakes, no easy wins, several teams that can win every year – league in America.
Coach Vogts record is beyond impressive, but winning 5 championships in Class II on LI is totally different than 13 CHSFL championships.
you do have one good point about bias that goes into any “who is best” conversation. The difference in this case is I’m not saying Vin O’Connor is the “best” x’s and o’s coach, or best motivator or best at in-game adjustments or best game-planner, etc. What I have said is he is the “most accomplished” and I’ve given you tons of facts to back that up. I don’t think anyone could disagree with that seriously. Rich Reichert the head coach at St Anthony’s could make an argument as the current best coach, Lou Dirienzo, TOny Dematteo and Dino Garr could be in the conversation on certain levels. But in terms of “most accomplished” it is a total different story.
Hoops & Fact,
Vin OConnor as best ever for my 2 cents..done in a much tougher arena than Bethpage..and really Skip Violante has the best win pct, titles, longest win streak etc at Dobbs and Somers and yes he made Somers what they are and handed over the keys after his 3 boys graduated..had he not stepped away frm coaching, his numbers would dwarf everyone in Sec 1 and hed be second to Vogts..and thats a fact..Everyone forgets Violante is/was the standard..Dematteo comes to mind quickly but North Rockland has been the team since 1985 in Sec 1in large schools..New Ro had ups and downs in those 25 years and Roosevelt was second fiddle whe NRock showed on the Sec 1 scene in most years. The NewRo run consistently dates about 10 years.
Right now all I got for “tons of proof” is:
“Go ask Joe Paterno or Mike Quick”.
“Go ask NY Post, Daily News or Newsday”.
“CHSFL is the greatest league, EVER”
Seriously, I have no problem with the sources, but asking me to “go ask” is not showing proof from them. Sorry, but no one in my fav 5, so I won’t be able to ask. If they all had articles voting O’Connor as the Grand Puba of HS Coaching, I guess then we would have at least more “proof”.
Proof, I believe, would have to start with these questions:
– Who has the most wins?
-How many league Championships and what league, what year, for 50+++ years.
-What class were both when they won their respective titles, ie. has St Francis titles all come in AAA; Bethpage all in class II
– How does AAA Title compare to a Class II title in LI when the LI pool of teams are greater, again not just last year, but the last 50+++. How does CHSFL AA Title compare to a Class II title in LI? Again, not just last year, but the last 50+++.
– Any common opponents, again not over the last 5 years, but 50+++.
It would take a process to show “proof”, remembering we are talking 57 years not, 5,10 or even 25.
Well at least we all can agree O’Connor is top two in the State!
PS. would love to see proof where Paterno has said for 4 standing decades CHSFL is the best football in NYS. AT the end of the day just one man’s opinion , but would love to see!
Dutchessfan, OUTSTANDING point. Skip took over a program that had the longest losing streak in NY. They then had the longest winning streak under his watch. After he left Somers, Dobbs was a mess. He came back, won a few state titles and left the program to the point where my daughters could have won state titles with.
Just a Fact,
You’re not making a point, you’re just trying to be agnostic about certain widely agreed upon certainties. You quite incorrectly say the only proof I offered is to “go ask…”. I give everyone on this blog a certain amount of credit for reading comprehension. If you somehow missed me writing 13 CHSFL championships, over 10 future NFL players, many college All Americans, scores of major college football players, several future coaches like Gerry Dinardo (LSU), then you weren’t reading very well.
If you want to make the point that you don’t KNOW the CHSFL is the best league in the state, thats your prerogative, but NO knowledgable football fan in NYS will agree with you. 13 CHSFL championships is unbelievable…13 championships in any sport in the toughest league in any state is amazing. Period.
To answer some of your hypothetical questions. Vogts titles all came in Class II, they never competed against the biggest schools in LI. O’Connor’s titles all came in the CHSFL AAA or its equivalent (was called AA for awhile and for most of his tenure there was only one class in the CHSFL). There is no comparison in the quality of teams they were playing. Feel free to reference Dutchess’ comment on the matter above.
Dutchess,
You make a great point about Violante. I was surprised when he got out of coaching so early. You’re probably right had he been coaching the last 10 years he’d be right up there in all-time wins in NYS after Vogts and O’Connor, maybe higher.
Just a Fact,
Here’s some “facts” for you. Below is an article from the Frank McGuire Foundation website. The McGuire Foundation is a fantastic group that honors the most outstanding HS coaches in all sports in the tri-state area. Local honorees have been Tony and Don Dematteo, Bob Cimmino, Spencer Mayfield, Dino Garr, Dom Cecere, Mike Chiapparelli, etc.
Coach Vincent O’Connor, the greatest High School Football Coach in New York State history, was honored at the 2nd Annual Fall Golf Outing of the Frank McGuire Foundation.
This event celebrated the life-long achievements of Coach O’Connor of St. Francis Prep, as he approaches his 80th birthday and begins his 57th season coaching football at the Prep (55th season as Varsity Head Coach).
an article from 2004 in the Orlando Sentinel about Coach O’Connor.
Here is another article about Coach O’Connor from the Orlando Sentinel July 04, 2004|By Bill Buchalter
Only one high school in America can claim the honor of having its football coach be named national coach of the year and an athlete who played for the coach to be similarly honored. That would be St. Francis Prep of Brooklyn. The head coach is Vince O’Connor, now in his mid-70s and trying to outlast legendary college coaches Joe Paterno and Bobby Bowden. He was named national coach of the year by the National High School Athletic Coaches Association in 1992. His athlete, who was named national coach of the year in 1993, is John Hemmer, who earned his award coaching track at Oak Ridge. Hemmer, who coached Oak Ridge to five state track championships, also served as president of the Florida and National Athletic Coaches Associations, and on the staffs of the 1992 U.S. Olympic team for Barcelona and the 1999 Seville World Championship team.
He played on a city championship football team in 1959 that was quarterbacked by Dan Henning, currently offensive coordinator for the Carolina Panthers. Henning’s guest was Bill Parcells, football coach of the Dallas Cowboys who once recruited Central Florida as a defensive assistant for Florida State. Henning also coached at FSU under Bill Peterson and one of his daughters went to UCF.
Just a Fact,
Here’s another article from Maxpreps that might be “proof” for you
http://cbs13.com/kickback/national.football.coaches.2.1135983.html
Hoops, why every time someone disagrees with you, out comes “reading comprehension”. I would copy paste from last year, but too boring. Also please stop with” knowledgeable football fans” that is like me saying 1 million guys on the Island agree blah blah blah blah. Stick with the points!
CHSFL AAA is currently a great league. Let’s say they are CURRENTLY the best. Just because a league is currently the best, does not make that league the best over the last 57 years, does it? Seems logical to me. If you are going to compare Great Coaches who both Coached for over 50 years, you need to measure all years, correct? That seems logical to me as well.
I see you mentioned O’Connor’s 13 Titles again, but failed to show proof why those are superior to Vogts 5 LI titles. A good start is to list out the years and at the time they were won, how did the league’s compare. While you are at it let me know why we should ignore the fact Vogts is the Winningest Coach in the State. And why we should ignore the countless playoff runs and 29 regular season league or conference titles. Competition not as good? If I use your logic, then Skip’s record at Dobbs means nothing when we compare Skip to any good Coach in AA, since AA teams are superior to Dobbs, correct? I do not think we really want to go there do we?
As for your link above, let me be the first to thank you on proving my point which is the two most accomplished coaches in the State are O’Connor and Vogt. Scroll down under V. Thanks again!
Just a Fact,
You understand A) the difference between being agnostic about proving the opposite of something (which is all you’ve done) and B) presenting facts that prove the positive (which is what I’ve tried to do). You haven’t said one thing or given one fact that proves anything affirmative in the discussion of Vogts vs. O’Connor, your entire position boils down to “I don’t know anything for sure.” Thats not intellectually defensible. If you have a position, try to prove it, don’t just be mentally lazy, ignore all the evidence in front of you and say “I don’t know for sure.” If I didn’t have a bunch of affirmative evidence for O’Connor, then it would be a pointless he said/he said discussion, but there is tons of info out there on O’Connor that proves the point. None that you’ve provided that proves the opposite – that summarizes the whole discussion.
I don’t expect you or anyone else to take my word for anything, so I’ve given you tons of referencable facts and I’ve suggested you reference EXPERTs. You reject anyone who actually KNOWS something about Vogts/O’Connor i.e. Paterno, Schiano, writers, etc, and prefer to stick with “I don’t know for sure” or “I can’t ask Paterno”, etc.
You seem to agree that the CHSFL is the best league in the state now. But you say “maybe they weren’t always the best” – fair point. I wouldn’t argue that at some point LI overall didnt have stronger football than the CHSFL for a time – I don’t know. But I do KNOW that Vogts never competed in the toughest class on LI. They are currently in the third toughest class, was for a long time in the second toughest class. So your attempt to question competition levels is futile – there is NO COMPARISON between the CHSFL and LI’s second toughest public school class.
Again, don’t take my word for anything, but do some research yourself and try to find something that proves your point. I certainly have never disagreed that Vogts and O’Connor are the two most accomplished coaches in NYS. The Maxpreps article may help prove they are the two best in NYS, but it certainly does nothing to put VOgts ahead of O’Connor and I haven’t found anything to suggest so besides your tacit agnosticism.
Just a Fact,
People can disagree with me all the time and I would never question their “reading comprehension”. But if we’re having a back and forth discussion and you clearly attempt to ignore or distort what I’m saying, then I would question it. I’m particularly referencing your post on 7/31 at 7:26am, where you wrote all i offered for proof was to “go ask…”. If thats what you genuinely thought, then you somehow missed or ignored me mentioning 13 CHSFL championships, 10+ future NFL players, future big time head coaches like Dan Henning (Chargers) and Gerry Dinardo (LSU), scores of major college football players and doing it all in the most competitive league in the state. We can also add in the 1982 National Coach of the Year award, being referred to as the greatest/most accomplishment HS football by every relevant NY publication (NY Times, NY Post, Daily News, MSG)
Frankly, if I at any point attempted to ignore or distort what you wrote I’d question my own reading skills (happens not too infrequently), but at this point you haven’t made any actually points or offered any actual information for me to ignore or distort.
Hoops Fan wins. Yeah. Hoops now go play in traffic you dork!!
Hoops, you want to throw insults, SPIN the story as usual, but I will unwind for you one last time. Then feel free to spin it anyway you choose. Insults and spin seems to be all you have at this point. It is no wonder why people usually avoid responding to your nonsense. You TWIST stories to no end and people have to go back to their prior posts to UNTWIST things. It is exhausting!
First off, please show where I stated CHSFL was (or wasn’t) currently the best league in the State. I said this “To say CHSFL AAA has been better than LI football since 1953 would be quite interesting to say the least”.
Now let’s go to the beginning. Your first statement:
“It leaves out undoubtedly the most accomplished football coach in NYS history. Vin O’Connor of St Francis Prep”
My response was I listed Coach Vogts accomplishments and said
“Going to be tough to equal, never mind beat!”
Not once was I saying Vogt was better, I clearly stated there is reason to have DOUBT as to who is the most accomplished since both men were so sucessful and their careers expand 50+++ years!
I have brought many reasons above why there is DOUBT as to who is the most accomplished coach. You say I present no “facts” and yet I had to post Vogt accomplishments TWICE for you since you wanted to ignore the FACTS presented. You seem to ignore all but what you want to hear and yet have the audacity to talk about reading comprehension. Funny guy!
What is even funnier, you copy/paste a link to PROVE O’Connor is the best Coach in NYS because Max Prep listed out best High School Coaches in the Country A-Z . You forgot to let everyone know Vogt was on the SAME list. Not one place on the link did they rank O’Connor over Vogt. Can’t even make this stuff up, it is so funny!
You see how you try and TWIST things?
If the only questionable “PROOF” you have is O’Connor did it vs. tougher competition two things. One you have not proved the competition was tougher over the past 57 years. Second, using your logic, even if Vogt wins were against weaker competition(not saying they were), then Coaches like Skip can never be in the same breath as a Casarella, Dirienzo, et all, since all play tougher competition. Personally, I believe you cannot ignore success. Vogt is the winningest Coach in the State and should not be diminished because it might be viewed as against “lesser competition”.
As for who is churning out College and Pro athletes, one question exists. Should a Coach be penalized because his pool of kids are not College/Pro Athlete material? I say no. Again using Dobbs, and this is a hypothetical, IF they did not churn out one D-1 athlete or Pro athlete during Skips run, it still should not diminish Skip’s accomplishments. Therefore, I do not believe what the kids do after high school should be a factor when comparing Coaches accomplishments. Wins and Championships are the KEY factors. Of course I am purposely leaving out the main accomplishment of any Coach which is to teach the kids how to act like Men. Different discussion.
As to number of Titles, O’Connor-13 CHSFL in a tough, but small league. Vogt-5 LI Titles in good, and HUGE area. Vogt also has won 29 League/Conference titles. The overall titles favor Vogt, but the leagues are set up differently. But these are the facts none the less.
So to recap, Coach Vogt’s coaching accomplishments are just as good as anyone’s in the State. My FACTS, My PROOF is the man’s accomplishments. I will list them a third time for you: “Nassau County playoffs 25 times since in 1970, and every year since the playoff system expanded to four teams in 1984. Vogts’ teams have won 29 regular season league or Conference Championships, 13 Conference Playoff Championships (ten since 1984), three Rutgers Cups, and five Long Island titles”
And I still stand behind these comments:
“Going to be tough to equal, never mind beat!”
Coach O’Connor and Coach Vogt are “undoubtedly” the two most accomplished Coaches in the State! See how easy that is to say?
Just a Fact,
I respect your knowledge and enthusiasm for football. Clearly, we both have tremendous respect for coaches like Coach Vogt and Coach O’Connor. This discussion clearly got out of hand.
We can summarize your entire point by your statement above “you have not proved the competition (in the CHSFL) was tougher over the past 57 years (than in LI Class II or Class III).” If you can’t agree the competition in the CHSFL was tougher than in CLass II on LI then you’re not going to agree that the sky is blue and there is no intellectual hope for you on this topic. NO ONE who has followed football for any length of time in NYS will agree with your statement. NO ONE. If you can find someone, please let me know. I went so far as to ask a few friends from LI whose opinions on football I greatly respect and NONE of them backed you up. Their consensus was a lot of fans on LI would argue during certain periods that Class/Conference I on LI was as good or better than the CHSFL, but its incomprehensible to think the Floral Parks and Bethpages of the world in CLass II are in the same conversation. One interesting point that was made to me is that LI football fans include the CHSFL LI teams (St Anthonys, Chaminade, St John the Baptist, Holy Trinity) when they talk about the talent/best teams on LI.
“Let’s say they are CURRENTLY the best” was used as a hypothetical like “for arguments sake”.
Just a fact, why are you bothering trying to explain yourself??? You will never win with this clown.
You are the man, don’t let this dork annoy you.
Just a Fact,
Presenting information is never twisting anything…its called presenting information. The bottom line on this topic is clearly you haven’t seen Coach Vogts teams play, you’re not familiar with who they compete against, you have seemingly no idea any of the players that played for him. You also seem to know little about the CHSFL or Coach O’Connor. I am a bit more informed on Coach O’Connor having seen his teams compete for years and years and know exactly who they were competing against. For instance, Coach O’Connor’s first HS All-American that I can remember was Ray Ratkowski a HB in the mid-50’s who starred at Notre Dame.
You have a couple important misconceptions about the “facts”. #1, the CHSFL has 19/20 teams and has been bigger at times. Class II on LI has about 27/28 teams (half in Nassau w/ Bethpage, half in Suffolk). For you to describe the CHSFL as a “small league” and Class II as a “huge area” then you’re clearly misinformed. Also, the size of schools in the CHSFL AAA is bigger than the male population in LI class II.
#2, if we’re talking about trying to prove a coach is the Most Accomplished in NYS history and half the “proof” you have is that he made 24 playoff APPEARANCES and won 29 division titles that seems a bit weak, no? Division titles are great, but if you’re in a division with 5-6 teams in Class II on LI, its not quite the same as winning a LI championship or CHSFL championship. Coach Vogts 5 LI titles is very impressive and speaks for itself along with the longevity of having won over 350 games in 57 seasons, but playoff appearances do little to bolster the case of a “most accomplished coach in NYS history”.
You do have one good point about if a coach should be penalized if he’s not coaching big-time players or is coaching in a small class like Skip Violante as your example. I don’t think a coach should be penalized for that, but I also think its fair to say it is MORE IMPRESSIVE if as a coach you’ve accomplished equal or more on a LARGER scale against better competition. Playing on the biggest stage against the best competition is usually the biggest challenge, and there is no reason to discount.
My main disagreement with your position, is that despite the fact that you have little or no direct knowledge of Coach Vogts or Coach O’Connor, you seem to disregard qualified sources that do. If I didn’t know much about a topic, then found out the NY Times, NY Post, Daily News, MSG, Frank McGuire Foundation (premier group for outstanding tri-state area HS coaches), all agree on it – I’d sure have to have some great info to disagree with them. You ignore the fact that all the experts and people with real knowledge of the situation disagree with you. This creates an almost impossible situation for you to defend.
Cant we all just get along? Whats funny is about 4 of us are paying any attention to this at this point..LOL
Dutchess,
You’re a voice of reason. Clearly nothing funny about the discussion at this point.
Lets chalk this up to the heat and absence of any worthwhile football news outide of this mornings Conelly bomb. Not one captain interview from Somers, Nyack, Bonxville,Ossining,NRo, NRock,Mahopac, Carmel, WP, MV, Ramapo..Im bored to tears at this point..How bout we hear about former JJCR d coord Charlie West joining Carmel and its impact, a catch up w Dakota Degree or Rob Lombardo as he preps for his plebe year at Navy..something, anything but camp updates and captains corners. The highlights saved this from a slow death.
DutchessFBfan… I can assure you that every coach and/or school was contacted about captains. Some teams don’t have captains yet. Others have not replied. Still, there are many more to come.
Good point Josh..then they shouldnt complain about coverage as you always hear. Id say doesnt have to be a capt to be of interest though.Did a lot of coaches just ignore you outright? I could see maybe not wanting to higlight a kid but to not respond is wrong I shouldve chosen better wording..didnt mean to take swipe at you. Sorry about that.
Woahh,
thanks for the advice, lol!
Josh,
Can we expect some North Rock info soon? Ramapo?
I know Dutchess is out of the JN coverage area, but does that make it out your reach on the blog? DutchessFBfan had mentioned JJEF was at a camp a week or two ago and it would be interesting to know how those teams performed. Can we expect any additional Dutchess info?
Just A Fact,
RCK is at Yorktown every night this week too, they scrimmage Thursday from 5-7..JJEF and POK in Lagrange last week..Arlington @ Arlington this week and I think goes down at weeks end Ive heard to scrimmage Somers at the Block & Tackle camp in Somers. Maybe a stop by Yorktown and we get some Dutchess coverage by default and confirm Arlington at Block and Tackle Camp..Josh?Hudson Valley Sports Report really right now is the only way to follow Dutchess FB when they dont play a West,Put,Rock team..the POK Journal has nothing.
Just A Fact,
JJEF looked better than I thought. They will pass much more which Im sure has you cringing but may help Urcoli in the long run..they have a real nice QB in Cody Bennett who has a big arm, something they missed last year. His main target should be Vito Boffoli whos smallish but great hands and quickness. Some decent size lineman just not as big as last year. Could surprise some and would be real dangerous with Coach Walsh still in charge..theyll finish a bit above .500 I think..
Dutchess, sounds like JJEF might have been left in good hands. Hopefully it does not end up being a futile attempt to introduce something new like North Rock. I think it was 2007 or 2008, they tried to introduce the Spread and just was plain ugly. Some teams are meant to run it down your throat!!!!
New Coach, new philosophy, maybe a balanced attack will put JJEF over the top. Great to hear they could be in the mix. Great year ahead in AA, and just around the corner.
Dutchessfan, I didnt know about Charlie. WOW thats BIG. He and Boyer best coordinators/ assistants in section. Whyd he leave JJCR?